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TV Squad's Lost discussion

by Chris Thilk, posted Oct 5th 2006 3:27PM
The folks here at TV Squad have been having quite an interesting conversation behind the scenes regarding last night's season premiere of Lost. I don't watch the show (I know J.J. Abrams has no idea what he's doing and is making it up as he goes along. That's what he did with Alias and it's likely what he's doing on Lost) but thought that the way those who had tuned in was worthy of publishing for the masses to see. So after the jump you can read the uncensored thoughts of the TV Squad staff.

Keith McDuffee
What did you other watchers of Lost think of the premiere? I thought it was pretty disappointing myself.

Tom Biro
I'd have to say that while there were some cool things that were unveiled (umm, like a civilizationish place on the damn island?), but while we keep learning a bit more about characters on the show, I can't decide if I'm happy or not that we just keep weaving and weaving and weaving. In a way, I can agree with the harsh critics who say that JJ and Co. have no idea what is going to happen. Then again, anyone who just decides that "we can make the show go seven years" is just setting themselves up for failure.

Brett Love
I found the first episode rather annoying, but wasn't sure if we wanted to put up negative Lost posts. My big issues with the show are first, enough with Jack and his freaking dad. We get it. There are a thousand more tales to tell, all of which would be more compelling. And more importantly, the show is becoming a game to see just how little they can actually tell the viewer and still manage to fill the hour. Walt? Kidnapped? Tests? Experiments? We're just forgetting about that? It was the cliffhanger
for season one for cryin out loud and they still haven't rapped that up. The thing that really burns my ass though is the Lost fan rally cry. After each episode that is ultimately a disappointment I never fail to read somewhere, "But next week looks good."

Jonathan Toomey
Am I the only one who liked it...? Despite what did seem like an excessive amount of commercials (there wasn't though, the ep was still about 45 minutes long), I thought it was good. We got more background on The Others in the first 5 minutes than we've gotten in two seasons even if it is still vague as to why they are there. And I honestly liked the Jack flashbacks in this one. Up until now, I wasn't really getting the tension between him and his father... now we do.

Tom
I think it's less about disliking and more about just shrugging and saying "oh, okay, whatever."

We "learned" more about the Others, but not really. It's like we saw the beginnings of Anakin Skywalker turning "bad" and then seeing the scene where the Emperor says "Rise, Lord Vader." Umm, okay, but like what about all the crispy stuff we've been hearing about?

We still have zero clue about the whole island area that they're on, how you get there, etc., what was that earthquake, and are they doing it on purpose, i.e. the remnants of the whole Hanso stuff, WTF was with the polar ending to last season, did we leave that alone? It's just frustrating to cherrypick stuff like this and not really have any consistency. One other thing - did Sawyer have a band-aid on his arm, too? Didn't notice.

As for the 45 minutes, that amazes me, but then again maybe it's just that they did like all the ads in four minute blocks, because that's just brutal. Even then, it's probably more because ALL the ads are stacked up in the last 40 minutes or whatever.

Annie Wu
I was desperate for some news about the other characters and... NOTHING. I got NOTHING. I know Kate, Jack, and Sawyer are generally the fan-favorites, but c'mon. That was just plain mean.

Bob Sassone
I actually liked it a lot. It would have been nice to see the other castaways, but this was a strong episode. I loved the beginning, because not only did we see the Others in their homes, it was really cool to see the plane crash from another angle, the Others' reaction to it, what Henry Gale told Ethan and others to do.

Another thing: I think we finally know that this whole thing REALLY happened. Remember all the talk of the plane crash wasn't real, it was an illusion, they're in hell, all that stuff, but now we've seen the plane crash was real, and I'm glad we've moved on to showing another community. (Oh, and the guy who brought Kate to her cell told Sawyer it took the bears only two hours to get the food...I guess that answers the polar bear question, sorta).

Jen Creer
I would have thought the little civilization that the Others have created was very cool if they didn't persist in conducting these humiliating psychological games with the plane crash victims. It was reminiscent of The Village-- only instead of fucking with the villagers' perceptions of reality and the time they really live in, they are fucking with the plane crash victims. And honestly, after you have survived a crash like that, do you really need this shit?

All we really know is that there is some kind of tension between Ben and Juliette (which we mostly get delivered in the form of her liking to read schmaltz and him not liking it), which just sets us up for knowing that she is eventually going to turn on Ben and help Jack. Anyone want to take that bet?

But who was the other guy in a cell, who tried to escape? And if you don't want people on your island, why don't you just get them the hell off your island?

I thought it was promising at first, but the weird-ass way the Others are treating everyone was just too unsettling. I promise to like it only if this is an allegory of the current political climate, and we are getting a full glimpse of the ramifications of recently passed legislation...

Brett
Did anyone recognize the boyfriend of Jack's wife? He looked familiar to me, but I'm not quite nutty enough to place him.

Joel Keller
So... what is this 'Lost' show you all are talking about? Is this on network TV?

Tom
BTW, what was the name that Juliette had for Henry Gale when they were in their little town, and he was upset that he was out of the book club?

Keith
Jack's wife's boyfriend sure looked a lot like McDreamy on Grey's. It's not though.

Richard Keller
I thought last night's episode was fantastic. All of the major plot points were resolved and we saw everyone on the island return to their normal lives. Of course, that was the episode I performed with finger puppets in my basement; I have no idea what happened on the television version. By the way, my finger puppet version is FAR superior and commercial-free!

Wil Wheaton
I loved the first season of Lost, and watched the entire thing on DVD in less than a week. When I got to the end, I went straight to iTMS and bought a subscription to season two, which I also watched in less than a week to get caught up to the new episodes on television.

Season two wasn't nearly as solid as season one, trading character development and those fantastic flashbacks for episodes that stretched ten minutes of story into an hour of broadcast. Once the creative team decided to make the show all about trickling out new bits of information about The Others and Dharma, I started to feel like I was watching Twin Peaks all over again. When I saw that giant four-toed foot at the end of last season, I was pretty sure the joke was on me.

Nevertheless, I'm invested in the characters, and the previews looked good, so I settled in last night with an eager and open mind.

For the first few minutes, I was as excited as I'd ever been. It was very cool to see the plane come down, and see The Others spring into action. In many ways, it reminded me of The Other 48 Days, but the episode quickly stumbled (not helped by the frequent commercials) and ended up being as unsatisfying as Three Minutes.

From a practical storytelling point of view, the excessive and frequent commercials were a very bad idea. They came so frequently, the show never really got a chance to develop much dramatic tension. The commercial breaks were obviously not a writing or creative decision, though; it's a network decision, and I think it was a big mistake that hurt the show. (ABC needs to recoup a lot of their investment in Path to Bullshit, though, so maybe they're using Lost ad sales to refill the company coffers.)

Commercials aside, from a creative point of view, the episode just wasn't that good. I waited all summer long to see where the story was going, and all I got was 45 minutes of what I sincerely hope is a set-up for a big payoff very soon, like in the next three episodes. A Tale of Two Cities did very little to move the story forward, and it had no second act. The lame flashback didn't help, either. (Okay. Jack has lots of problems with his dad. We get it. Do we really believe that his dad would sleep with his wife anyway? Come on, writers. That was lame.) Was anyone surprised by anything? Other than Henry Gale being "Ben," I mean. Thanks for that big revelation, writers. That was worth waiting all summer for.

While I understand that the story will play out over the rest of the season, as a fan of the show, I wanted the first episode after the hiatus to be a good one -- no, a great one -- one that validated my wait all summer and left me counting down the minutes until next week. When the show was over, I felt neither of those things. The content of last night's episode would have been a passable first hour of a two hour show, if the second hour was phenomenal, but I was left feeling annoyed and disappointed. I didn't even want to watch The Nine afterward, because I'm not falling for another show where I invest thirty hours in characters and a complex storyline, only to discover somewhere around the middle of the second season that the writers are
just making it up as they go along.

While it's too early to say that Lost has jumped over one of Dharma's mysterious sharks, their creative team is clearly strapping on water skis. I'm willing to give Lost two more episodes, but if they're like this one, I'm done punching in the numbers.

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Tom

Hey, just getting around to joining ou all at tvsquad this year.

I liked the episode, though I agree it was lackluster. I'm intrigued by the "others" plotline, and I'm loving Elizabeth Mitchell's joining the cast. What can I say--I like blonds. Here's to more Emilie de Ravin having a more prominent role in all of this.

Everyone seems really frustrated with this show lately. Its like you expect everything to be answered with each new episode. Chill out people. It's a slow burn. Enjoy the ride. I can guarantee the revelation will be disappointing, so just try and enjoy the journey.

I have some questions remaining from this episode:

(1) What was the name of the Stephen King book they were reading in the book club? Does anyone know. The books in the show are never incidental. Perhaps its just a nod to the very public fan/loyalty of Stephen King?

(2) Is this the underwater station that was alluded to in S2? If they were dropping hints about that last season, then there really must be a plan, eh?

(3) Who is Jack's ex-wife's lover? It sure seems like the kind of detail the writers WOULDN'T just make incidental.

I dig the Talking Heads catch, guys. That's the kind of detail I would have missed if it weren't for you guys. How can you tell--the jacket art?

Finally, just a thought to ponder about the way last season ended. Do you think Walt and Michael are gone for good? I could see it. I envision this. Michael has served out his character arc. He served to bring the main characters to the "others." Walt, posessing psychic powers, has been tested by the others, and my guess is that they have determined he is "not the one," that his powers aren't significant enough for our purposes. Michael's and Walt's back story are reasonably concluded--father and soon reunited, Walt's powers explored and rejected, and they are given a boat and the "key" to the way out.

It will be interesting to see how the writers bring them back, if at all.

October 21 2006 at 2:55 PM Report abuse rate up rate down Reply
AKA

That being said... I thought the premier episode was mediocre, but not because of the lack of answers... mostly because it just wasn't that interesting to watch.

October 09 2006 at 7:32 PM Report abuse rate up rate down Reply
AKA

There seems to be a whole lot of hooting about how the "writers are just making it up as they go along."

Well... yes. That's the way TV works.

You can have a general idea of where you are going... but you cannot have a completely solid plan. Things happen and they would ruin your plan. Bad chemistry... an actor doesn't want they're contract renewed. An actor is a PAIN to deal with and you want them gone. The network decides the direction is too obtuse. Grey's Anatomy kicks ass and they want more love story. The OC kicks ass and they want an "event" in every episode. The audience decides it doesn't want to see a certain character or plot line. These things happen and if you have a rock solid plan you can't adjust to them. The trick is to not write yourself into a corner.

You want to know what LOST knew when it began?
Season 1: the survivors of the front of the plane.
Season 2: the tailies
Season 3: the others.
Season 4: If we get here... BIG FAT QUESTION MARK. We'll figure it out in season three.

Whatever season four ends up being... it will be set up this season with nothing to do with anything set up from the first or second seasons. This is because the original premise sets up 3 seasonal arcs.

What makes a show good isn't whether the writer's "know where it's going in the end"... it's whether the writer's can make the long run, through the fog of the unknown, enjoyable along the way.

If you want a show that knows where it's going to end... watch a mini-series or a BBC series. It's not hard to know where you end when you only have six episodes and you write them all before production even starts.

Knowing every step of 100 episodes over 4-5 years is impossible.

October 09 2006 at 7:30 PM Report abuse rate up rate down Reply
nushu

Hi, I liked the episode. C'mon guys, wait and see!!

But nobody got the Stephen King's book Juliette is holding when the plane crash!! and the comments about: "nobody will read this even in the toilette" HAHAHA..

I liked that one.

October 08 2006 at 6:09 AM Report abuse rate up rate down Reply
Elana

Thanks Wil...this is exactly what I'm feeling too, but couldn't put in words...

October 07 2006 at 5:21 AM Report abuse rate up rate down Reply
Jay

Like Wil, I took to the series like a house afire on DVD, but flagged at the squicky kidnapping of Walt at the end of S1 (I'm watching this with my 10 yo son), and wikipedia'd S2. S3 started with a whimper for me.

I'm with Wil - two more episodes of real time to decide if I'm jumping the shark or not. For me, this is way too much about the egos of the creators and stories along the lines of "the giant's toenail,"* rather than delivering quality entertainment. If we jump the shark, no problem. There are some great books out there involving island survival, with no commercial interruptions!

*Remember those great 6th grade philosophical discussions about what IF our whole universe was just one molecule of a giant's toenail...?

October 06 2006 at 5:35 PM Report abuse rate up rate down Reply
BobbyBuz

Here's the lyrics to "Burning Down the House." Something to play with:

Speaking in Tongues "Burning Down The House"

Watch out you might get what you're after
Cool babies strange but not a stranger
I'm an ordinary guy
Burning down the house

Hold tight wait till the party's over
Hold tight We're in for nasty weather
There has got to be a way
Burning down the house

Here's your ticket pack your bag: time for jumpin' overboard
The transportation is here
Close enough but not too far, Maybe you know where you are
Fightin' fire with fire

All wet hey you might need a raincoat
Shakedown dreams walking in broad daylight
Three hun-dred six-ty five de-grees
Burning down the house

It was once upon a place sometimes I listen to myself
Gonna come in first place
People on their way to work baby what did you except
Gonna burst into flame

My house S'out of the ordinary
That's might Don't want to hurt nobody
Some things sure can sweep me off my feet
Burning down the house

No visible means of support and you have not seen nuthin' yet
Everything's stuck together
I don't know what you expect starring into the TV set
Fighting fire with fire

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm!

October 06 2006 at 2:03 PM Report abuse rate up rate down Reply
BobbyBuz

"It was VERY clear that the CD that was being opened up and placed in the CD player was for Speaking in Tongues by Talking Heads (a current, 2006 Dual Disc limited edition copy no less!!!) and yet the music playing was Petula Clark??? I really don't mean to nitpick but it doesn't take THAT much effort to get somewhat close to the correct props needed for these scenes. Either that or don't zoom in close enough for the audience to be able to see this blatant an error."

Perhaps the writers were just playing games with us, the audience. I find it ironic and humorous that the first cut on the Talking Heads album was "Burning Down the House." Then thirty seconds after she starts the Petula Clark song the smoke alarm goes off and Juliette burns her hand.

Is there any connection between the Talking Heads and Petula Clark?

October 06 2006 at 1:51 PM Report abuse rate up rate down Reply
Fran

JJ Abrams may have started out as a brillant producer, but one thing that I found out over the years is that he can't work on more than one project at a time. He created Alias, and it was great. Then he created Lost which was great in the beginning, while he let Alias die a slow death. Last season Lost paid the price for his working on MI 3 by giving us rerun after rerun. Now he is working on another new series, and Lost is being neglected by him. Please start concentrating on Lost and Lost alone, so that we can have a good new season with new ideas and new revelations. Give us something for all our patience and loyalty.

October 06 2006 at 1:48 AM Report abuse rate up rate down Reply
Ryan

JJ wrote the teleplay for last nights ep. He is also involved much more this year because he doesn't have Mi-3 in the way. When it leaves and comes back in feb he is going to direct the return episode. I thinks it's gonna be two hours. I enjoyed last nights ep it was entertaining and built is a good build up. I just hope that more action happens this year like years one. I agree with the other guy that we can't all complain. If you don't like it, don't watch it. I enjoy all the story weaving together to create the bigger picture and this year I'm sure we will learn so much more...

October 05 2006 at 11:36 PM Report abuse rate up rate down Reply

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