Dan Milano, Spencer Chinoy and Sean Baker on Bringing Warren The Ape to MTV

Way, way back in January, MTV introduced the nation's critics at the TCA press tour to Warren The Ape. But it was a re-introduction to many. Warren -- a failed actor / successful drunk named Warren Demontague who is a fuzzy ape with a soft helmet on his head -- is familiar to fans of the various 'Greg the Bunny' shows, which have appeared on IFC and Fox since the early 2000s.

This time, though, the focus is on Warren and his bumpy life. During the series, we see Warren trying out for roles, getting pulled over by the cops, and going to meetings. Lots of meetings. He's a fabricated American (PC for "puppet") with a lot of vices, and we tag along with him as he tries to work it out, including to his weekly therapy sessions with Dr. Drew Pinsky (yes, the real Dr. Drew). Suffice to say, Warren's finding reform hard.

'Warren The Ape' premieres on MTV tonight at 10:30PM ET. After that January session, I spoke to 'Greg' and 'Warren' creators Sean Baker, Spencer Chinoy and Dan Milano (Dan is the puppeteer and voice of both Greg and Warren) about shifting to Warren, how Dr. Drew took analyzing puppets seriously, and whether 'Greg' fans will see their favorite characters show up during the series (one word: Wumpus).

Also after the jump, I'll replay my interview with Warren, which I originally posted back in January.

After all the iterations of Greg the Bunny, what made you guys decide to want to concentrate on Warren, and on top of that, how did MTV get into it?
Sean: Well, I can just say that from the very beginning, people always asked us, when is Warren getting his own show? And so he was actually a favorite amongst fans, and just our peers for a while. He was so developed as a character that we knew that we could actually, the style of reality would be perfect for him, because it was basically just, I would love to see what this guy's life is like. Follow him around.

Dan: At one point, we were going to do a concept for a movie and follow a bunch of the characters, so here's what Warren deals with, here's what Count Blah deals with, you know. And Warren's story got us the most excited. Then when it seemed like we weren't going to do a film, but maybe a TV concept, we tried to take that concept to a show pitch, we tried to hone it, and then eventually, we just kept saying, well, God, if we could do a reality show, it should be Warren.

Ironically, when we first brought it to MTV, they sort of said, well Greg is the franchise character, so we'd kind of like to see a show about Greg. So we did something with the two of them, and their opinion in the testings sort of seemed to indicate that, they're like yeah, you know, Warren is really interesting. I think they just had to get to know the character. So we've clearly, now we're all on the same page.



The idea of bringing Warren to rehab seems like a natural. Especially with the rehab shows that are all over VH1. And then bringing in Dr. Drew on top of that... So how did that idea start?
Sean: It was really, I think it was done as more of like a favor. We had the opportunity to actually just have, shoot a 30 minute one-on-one between Dr. Drew and Warren, and it was completely improvised. I don't think there was a word scripted, right?

Spencer: Yeah. In fact, Sean and I weren't even there.

Dan: All the we did was that the three of us wrote up like some paragraph information for Drew, to say here's who Warren is, and da da da. But his attitude was like, "I've seen your show, I know who Warren is. I don't want to read any of this stuff. Just bring the puppet."

Sean: I'm sure he was a fascinating subject for the guy, being a professional doctor.

Dan: He interviewed Greg and Warren. Yeah. And he knew the characters already from our shows. I guess he knew Seth Green and Sarah Silverman, and he's kind of a fan of comedy. I mean, he was quoting, I think he was quoting like Family Guy and Robot Chicken, just in casual conversations. He's a nerd, which is cool. (laughs) He's one of us.

And also, I know he's spent all that time with Adam Corolla...
Dan: Yeah, sure of course. So anyway, long story short, yeah, did an improv where he basically analyzed or had a session with Greg and Warren, and the footage was so funny, and it blew everyone's mind, including me. Because I was not prepared for having him seriously pick them apart and try to figure them out.

Spencer: My first thought on it when I saw the footage was that, you know, for so many years, Sean and I were Greg's tormentors, physically abusing him all the time and just being cruel. But when I saw that initial therapy session between Dr. Drew and Greg, I was like, this is probably the coolest thing that's ever happened to Greg. Because he was really making him look at himself. And Drew even said, like as messed up as Warren is...

Dan: Greg is worse.

Spencer: Yeah, Greg is worse. He's got so many balls up.

Because Greg's oblivious
Dan: Yes. That was really interesting. Because he said, you know, to be honest, he goes, "I think Warren's really funny, but like I deal with 100 Warrens a day." He's like, "Warren's not new. But I've never, Greg is someone who has an arrested personality."

Sean: Man child.

Dan: He's a man child. He's got the high squeaky voice, you know, he even suggested to Greg, you know, is like, were you ever sexually, you know, assaulted as a child? And Greg just laughed, and he's like, (in a Greg voice) "You said sexual." And Dr. Drew is just staring at him like he's never had such a tough...

Spencer: And then we had to all decide, was Greg molested?

Dan: Yeah, then we had to have a conversation. "Well holy crap, now these sessions are making us talk about our character, and so these improvs are affecting the stories and the personalities."



So Drew literally analyzed two puppets? And it seems like he took it seriously?
Sean: Took it quite seriously.

Dan: Oh, 110 percent.

Sean: And he had 30 minutes on each that was 30 minutes of gold. We had to cut it down in the presentation tape to about a minute and a half. But there's a lot more of it.

Dan: It makes sense... obviously he knows people and he knows pathologies, and people's patterns. So that also just, I think, makes him a good judge of character And he seems like a really funny, sharp guy. So he knows these shows he likes and why. You know, he's seen every episode of The Comeback, which was that Lisa Kudrow show on HBO, which was brilliant. So I think he knows where the comedy...that the comedy needs to come from reality, so it's a good fit.

How many episodes is he going to be on? All of them?
Spencer: All of them. Yeah.



It looks like, from the clip reel that they show, that you're going to try to work in some more fabricated Americans. How is that going to going to work?
Dan: Well it's not, the show, the disconnect is that, you know, it needs to be made clear that our show is not about Warren stuck in rehab somewhere. The show's about Warren's life and following his daily life. And part of his routine is to go to his sessions with Drew, who's his doctor. We have episodes that involve him in rehab, but mostly it's him in Hollywood, going on auditions, you know, going to his classes, going to you know, the kind of stuff that most actors do. It's just that Warren is also an addictive personality.

So in that world, you'll see more of the fabricated Americans?
Dan: Yeah. We're going to introduce neighbors who are puppets, and we have...

Sean: We're gonna put competitive actors. We had a character by the name of Chauncey the Bear, very close to a Snuggles type bear, who always lands the commercials because he's cute.

And you say you're going to work Greg in here and there? Any clue of where we're going to see Greg?
Spencer: Warren tries to get Greg laid.

Sean: Yeah, basically. We want to keep Greg's moments, you know, we can't show him, we're not bringing him in a lot in this season. So when we do bring him in, we want them to be special. (chuckle) And we're focusing about two of the episodes on Greg.

How about some of the other characters like Blah and some of the other ones? Are they going to be worked in, or are they going to be Easter eggs for Greg the Bunny fans?
Dan: We're looking for places, because we're aware that there's a fan base that wants to see some of these characters. we want to also. But we're still in the process of writing and getting stories approved as we're starting to shoot some of the first couple episodes. So we're still figuring a lot of that out.

Sean: But that's a great way of putting it, an easter egg. Because actually, in our last episode, the 2nd episode, you see Wumpus for a moment.

Dan: In the background.

Are we going to see anybody besides Dr. Drew, as far as like known names or faces?
Dan: We're working on a bunch of cameos. Right now, we're working with this up and coming face, this guy Josh Sussman, who's on 'Glee,' who is hysterically funny and has really claimed the role of Warren's assistant.

Which role is Josh on 'Glee?'
Dan: Josh is the, on Glee, he's the nerd who's always hitting on the mean girl. He's the nerd with the Art Garfunkel haircut.



All of you work on other projects. What brings you back to the Greg and Warren, time after time?
Sean: Well, when the opportunity arises, we're all jumping on board. And of course, this guy (Dan) has to come on board no matter what. No, but you know, we created together, it's something that we'll always do together.

Spencer: We like to think of it as like our, not to put ourselves in the same camp as Monty Python, but the Monty Python members, the way that they would make a movie and then go off and work on their separate projects, and then come back together.

Dan: That's what we'd love to always do. But the other thing that drives us is this desperate desire to do it right. Not that we're not proud of every iteration of Greg the Bunny that we've ever done, it's just that it was either so independent that, it was so garage band that we always said oh, what if we just had a little money, and then you get to Fox and suddenly there's millions of dollars, oh there's too much money! And so now there's too many people controlling it. And now we're back on IFC and we have a little bit of money and a little bit of control.

Sean: No exposure.

Dan: We're constantly trying to get what we always had. And we're pretty close this time. I mean, I think we're closer than we've ever been.

Spencer: This is the best setup.

Is it because it's on MTV and it's because it kind of follows, it's such, that whole celebrity rehab thing is so kind of out there, I mean, is that why you think this is the best combination?
Sean: I think that's one of the reasons. Also, you know, the style, the parody of the reality show, it's very close to what we were doing in the very beginning. I'm talking way before IFC, like Junktape. We were going with our camcorders on the street with these puppets, and it was whatever they were doing during the day. If they were going into Tompkins Square Park and interacting with whoever was there, we would just, in a way document it.

Dan: There weren't reality shows. And The Office didn't exist. And Curb Your Enthusiasm didn't exist. So when you walk into a Fox network executive's office and we're like, :we want to do a cinema verite style documentary show with puppets," and they look at you like...you know, you lost us. The closest they could come was a sort of "ALF meets Larry Sanders." So now, you can point at these things and earn a little trust on the network side. And we have good producers yhey really push for us doing it our way, and MTV's pretty creator-friendly, and has been very cool about, you know, letting us find our process.

So what would you guys, if this thing actually lasts beyond one season...
(mass laughter)
Sean: Holy s***!

Dan (as Warren): Shut the f*** up. Seriously.

What would you guys consider this, given the history with this, what would make you consider this version to be the most successful iteration?
Dan: Oh, what is our like criteria for success?

Spencer: What is our goal, also, with the long term of this show?

Dan (to Spencer): Well what would make you feel that, like cancelled or not, or whatever, what would make you look at the show and say like yeah, we succeeded this time. That was the show I wanted to make.

Spencer: I feel already with where we're at, we're at that point. And I think it's just that...you know what, I'll let one of you answer that first, because I'm kind of...

Dan (to Sean): What do you think? It's a good question, but it's a hard one to answer.

Sean: Really, it's really hard. Because we're right in the process now. And we're going day by day and hardly seeing 24 hours ahead of us. But I do have to say that we're just looking to make these solid, funny episodes. Funny from beginning to end. With a lot of...I think the great thing about Warren, the great thing that Dan brings to Warren is that, and I know this is a little geeky here, but remember the line at the end of 'Star Trek 2' when Spock dies? Well, Warren is one of the most human people I know.

And I think that that is what, if we can get that across, if we can deliver that to the audience with character, it's all about character, and if they can identify with Warren and root for Warren at the end of the episode, no matter what reprehensible stuff he's done earlier on in that episode, then we've succeeded.

Dan: Yeah, I mean, I think if we can look at the show in a year or two and feel like the character as we know him has been preserved for what goes on air, then that's the definition of success. If we can love it as much as everyone else does, then I feel like yeah, you know, now we've achieved something that, you know...

The last IFC iteration was probably more for the fans than anything else.
Dan: They didn't promote it, to be honest. They had a strong promotional push in NY, where we were already somewhat cult, but nothing really for the rest of the country. I don't know if they just didn't have the budget, or if they weren't behind it or what.

One final question, and this is probably the big, philosophical one. Do you still, would you rather be cult or would you rather be an MTV star?
Spencer: I'll answer that. I'd like to be cult with like s***loads of money.

Dan: With benefits. I want to be friends with benefits with the public.

Sean: We want to be that small cult film amongst millions of people.

Dan: Because we're older, we still want to make these things. I love being cult, but you know, of course, yeah, now we say that as we're in our...I'm pushing into my later 30's and I'm starting to think about yeah, I gotta make a living too. But I think there is a good place to be. I think Robot Chicken's in a good place. You know, they're not quite in the limelight, but they're doing well and they have a strong following. And that's a good, comfortable place to be.

Spencer: Just by the nature of our comedy, we're never going to appeal completely mainstream. Or at least we don't think we are. But we also...

Dan: We'd rather be 'Curb Your Enthusiasm' than 'Seinfeld.'

Spencer: Yeah. I think we have a good, you know, we might have a small audience, but they're pretty dedicated.

Sean: And I think it'll grow, especially with this.